Spears vs. Rebecca St. James
Tektonics.org debate below..
Let me start of by saying, that I would encourage everyone to download the debate from my website, "Life within the limits of Biblical and Islamic Morality" with Doug Beaumont of Southern Evangelical Seminary:
Recently I came across this article on ABC News, in which a overzealous Christian tries to pass judgment on Britney Spears, for her "immorality", and that some how, she is more "moral" and the ideal girl. I found this very ironic, because many of the issues presented in this ABC News article, is exactly what me and Matt Slick debated on, and this article will provide an excellent working example of many of the inherent problems with Biblical Christianity raised in the debate which Rev. Matt Slick simply shrugged off.
If one were to look closer look into the claims made by Rebecca St. James, they will find that her judgment calls on Britney are completely Biblically baseless and nothing more than her own personal prejudice and intolerance. But before, I begin, I think something needs to be said about these condescending remarks which some Christians make, like, "I feel sorry for you.." or any of the following:
"I will pray for you."
"Jesus loves you!"
"God loves you!"
"There must be some other reason that you are saying Ďnoí to Godís love."
"But Jesus/God still loves you!"
When certain Christians make these remarks, they want to make you feel "inferior". What they are trying to convey to you is, as a Christian they are a Better Person than the non-believer. Therefore, they must pity you. Also, it is obvious that the only reason people donít believe in (their version) Christ is because they need an excuse to live licentious and immoral lives. In addition to that, Since the FACT about God and Jesus is so obvious to us believers, there must be something wrong with non-believers who donít accept the obvious TRUTH.
But as we shall soon see, it will be Rebecca St. James whom we are going to feel sorry for. To start off, Rebecca attempted to criticize Britney Spears on her clothing, accusing her of being too promiscuous. Here, she gives the impression, that Britney dress style is going against the Bible. But this is not true. All the Bible states is be "modest" (1 Timothy 2:9), thatís it. But, the Bible does not state what clothing is considered modest. To put it in a nutshell, Modesty is simply an emotion. Itís a feeling one gets when they are personally satisfied with what they are dressed in. Therefore, Britney Spears fully meets this requirement, so long as she feels that she is modest.
In addition to all of this, Britney Spears does not wear any thing too much different than what most Christians wear on a beach. Now, donít tell me that the Bible says that it is ok to wear swimsuits on a beach, but not anywhere else!!! In the debate on Morality, this was a major source of embarrassment for Rev. Matt Slick, in which he blurted out, that the holy ghost inspired his wife to wear a one piece bathing suit vs. a 2 piece!!! Out of foolishness, somehow thinking that people can not download the debate from my website, he later then retracted that remark, claiming that he never said it. J
Let me ask, is wearing pants modest? Is wearing shorts modest? Tank tops? Dress covering the entire body? Swimsuit? Therefore, modesty is left up to the individual to decide. That is why you have many people among Christians dressed anywhere from skimpy Madonna type outfits or bikini type outfits, to huge dresses covering everything. According to the Bible, it is "all good". let me now pose this challenge to any Christian believer:
I challenge any Christian to prove from the Bible that wearing a Britney Spears type outfit is sinful or wrong, but wearing a pair of shorts or sleeveless shirt is "ok" according to the Bible.
Now, some Christians may look to see what the OT says, but, the laws of the OT has been cancelled out by the NT according to Christian doctrine, that is why Christians donít have to follow the 613 mitzvahs of the OT. She also tried to accuse Britney of almost asking men to treat her as a sex object. But, the very same objection can be used against her, but even more forcefully, because she has many traits, which men would consider to be sexy. I think we should leave it up to the men to speak for themselves, not Rebecca St. James as what should or should not turn them on ( hey, I always hate being told what to do). Therefore, in conclusion to this point, Rebecca St. James objections against Britney Spears is completely Biblically baseless and is another crude example, of how a self righteous pompous Christian tries to impose her own concocted values based on her own personal tastes and whims, on others.
Nevertheless, it is a well-known fact, that the dress a woman wears has a direct correlation to the moral decadence of a society. Even many of the most pious believers will "throw in the towel" when put in an environment of women wearing tightly fitted clothing and showing off many of their parts, day in day out. As we have just seen, Christianity is suffering from a terrible dilemma, in which there is no solution in the Bible to its problem. But, Islam, has the solution for the inherent problem of Christianity, please take a look at my debate references.
Rebecca St. James states, "My philosophy is, if you're committed to waiting then don't even go close to the lineÖ.". Finally, she says something intelligent. But this is not her own philosophy. Rather, this is a major theme of the Holy Quran! The Quran, not only forbids illegal sexual intercourse(29:45), but the Quran deliberately goes one step further, issues a clear command:
17:32. And come not near to the unlawful sexual intercourse. Verily, it is a F‚hishah [i.e. anything that transgresses its limits (a great sin)], and an evil way (that leads one to Hell unless All‚h forgives him). (Al-Isra 17:32)
Alas! This was my point which I just made above, and that I spent over an hour trying to point out in front of a belligerent and hostile Rev. Matt Slick! And that is, Islam has the solutions for todayís social problems. And Rebecca St. James unknowingly, beautifully illustrates this one noble truth of the Holy Quran. And as a result of this one verse of the Quran, dozens of moral principles have been derived from the scholars, which directly impact our daily lives.
Another point, which is extremely relevant to todayís society and the topic of "sexual promiscuity", is wear do you draw the line as far as men and woman contact or dating. Unfortunately, the Bible allows you to do EVERYTHING except for the actual act of sexual intercourse! For example, the Bible does not condemn using a computer or driving a car, therefore, the logical conclusion is that it must be ok to drive a car or use a computer. Using the same common sense, if the Bible does not condemn those sexual acts, then it is ok to do. This has been the topic of many comedians who joke, "Christian girls aint virgins!" due, to the sexual contact they engage in with men (except sexual intercourse). Let me issue the following challenge:
I challenge any Christian to prove from the Bible that it is ok for men and woman to kiss and hold hands on a date, but it is wrong or sinful for them to engage in any other kind of sexual activity except intercourse according to the Bible.
Therefore, let me encapsulate the type
of culture the Bible promotes: Men and woman walking around in tight fitted,
skimpy outfits exposing much of their parts, each one engaged in flirting and
indiscreetly seducing each other (there is no condemnation in the Bible for any
of this), and not only that, but engaging in several if not all sexual acts
except for sexual intercourse, engaging in "mashing", and all the
free cocaine, heroin and marijuana that they desire. A good example of living
within the confines of Biblical morality would be the "Girls Gone
Wild" commercials on TV, or MTV's spring break parties. No wonder we have
a screwed up society. (it was proved in the debate, that the Bible does NOT
condemn drug use, please see my references for more information) . And there
is no doubt, that, this Biblical culture is exactly what we see in
Debate with Christian Apologetic website, Tektonics.org:
Debate with Christian Apologetic website, SoulDevice.org:
Public Debate: Nadir Ahmed vs. Doug Beaumont Debate Biblical Morality
Other related issues: